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Message:	[quote=Nick Gammon] What is this circle snippet of which you speak? And as for area 0, change the if test to check for "Unknown". [/quote] Message to be posted (in English, please).
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Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Thu 02 Jun 2011 07:23 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I identified two sorts of data you would want to store:

Data supplied by the MUD (that is, the maps, area information, connecting exits, etc.)
Data entered by the player (eg. favourite shop, guild info, notes about mobs)

The easiest way of repopulating the MUD-related data is to rebuild the database from the MUD's supplied file (if any). And the most reliable way it just to clear the tables and start from scratch. But I didn't want to lose all the player-entered data.

I suppose you could clear everything, except bookmarks, which would have worked. But it would make it hard for you to distribute the built database, or if the MUD didn't supply the whole database, to give a friend the room info without your notes.

Hence the two databases.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Fiendish USA (851 posts)

bio Global Moderator

Date

Thu 02 Jun 2011 03:07 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I've been meaning to ask this for a really long time. Why did you originally make a second database file just for bookmarks?

http://aardwolfclientpackage.googlecode.com/

Posted by

Dontarion USA (62 posts)

Date

Sat 07 May 2011 05:07 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Sat 07 May 2011 07:01 AM (UTC) by Dontarion

Message

I've successfully converted the mapper over to working with GMCP. I used the Aardwolf GMCP plugin to handle data with a few tweaks for Achaea.

I added the ability to update room names if they're not the same as Achaea constantly goes through room name changes.

Soon I will be trying to change two things:
A: No more trying to map wilderness and subdivision rooms
B: Yanking area from GMCP data.
C: updating exits if they're wrong --> This may or may not happen.

--

I figured out how to avoid updating on wilderness rooms and area is already updating from GMCP now.

Posted by

Ahiram (14 posts)

Date

Sat 26 Mar 2011 01:31 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Actually, I fixed the problem. With the same answer you gave me last time. That atcp info in VadiSystem was configured to No (I had to get the system again and forgot to update) so everything is peachy again.

Posted by

Twisol USA (2,230 posts)

Date

Sat 26 Mar 2011 01:29 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Sat 26 Mar 2011 01:30 AM (UTC) by Twisol

Message

map.xml isn't a plugin, though. It's an XML dump of (almost) all of the rooms in Achaea. The Create_ATCP_Map_Database plugin converts map.xml into a database that the ATCP_Mapper can use.

Also, make sure that "Convert IAC EOR/GA to newline" is checked, in Game -> Configure -> Output.

'Soludra' on Achaea

Blog: http://jonathan.com/
GitHub: http://github.com/Twisol

Posted by

Ahiram (14 posts)

Date

Sat 26 Mar 2011 01:21 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I had to do a system restore to 2 days ago to fix an issue on my PC. Now, the mapper no longer works. I tried reinstalling everything, and the commands like MAPPER HELP still work but the plugin no longer tracks me. Also, unless I'm doing something wrong, MUSHClient is no longer understanding the plugin map.xml (lifted from www.achaea.com/maps/map.xml) The flow I'm using goes like this:

File -> Plugins... -> Add... -> ATCP_NJG -> ATCP_Mapper -> Create_ATCP_Map_Database -> map.xml

Everything loads up until the end. Mush tells me map.xml is not a plugin and thus will not be loaded. Even without map.xml, it won't create even a generic map for me. Anyone have any ideas?

Posted by

Dontarion USA (62 posts)

Date

Thu 17 Mar 2011 03:54 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

All/Nick:

I'm trying to build in a few things into the mapper but I'm having trouble. Achaea has an odd method of doing the subdivision/wilderness so it takes up non-used room numbers to generate them on the fly. Eventually when they build new rooms these UIDs get used but the mapper already has them filled. I'm trying to build a method to completely wipe the room from DB's and have other tables erased too (room exits, etc). Currently I've learned a bit about delete. Anyone else attempted this?

I'm also looking at making the update area list pool from the rooms db and not just a second db of the area names. I think this is how it's being populated now because the listing is area names that aren't being used and were just pulled from the achaea map converter.

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 10:57 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Yes I see what's happened now. The "script" you linked to (which is actually a list of changes) is only 153 lines, so you probably thought "won't take long to fix that".

But the actual mapper is 1600 lines of code, and the plugin which calls the mapper is another 1948 lines of code. So that's 3548 lines of code, before modifications. So add in the extra lines (say, 150) and we get around 3700 lines of code.

The mapper itself is fairly complex as it involves a lot of loops and recursive/iterative calculations as it "walks outwards" from where you are to draw the map. It was complex enough with fixed length exits, and having to take into account room coordinates when deciding where to draw each room would have added to the complexity.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 09:04 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I try to stay calm and usually find that helps keep other people calm as well.

BeardedBuddhist said:

For god's sake would y'all just look at the bloody script.. it would take less time than to type out to tell me you haven't seen the script.

This one?

http://pastebin.com/3L421QyT

Perhaps I was assuming too much when I said it was a patch. Maybe I assumed you knew what that meant. However I did look at it, I don't know how you could know I didn't.

A patch is like a list of changes. In itself, it won't run. It goes like "add this, change that". So you can't just read it and see the problem. You have to go back to the original, apply all the changes, to get the amended version.

Let me explain like this ... say you have a Kung Fu manual, and you get a message from HQ saying "change the word on line 5 of page 3 from 'always' to 'sometimes'".

In itself that tells you absolutely nothing about what the manual said to do before, and what it says to do now.

So to get anywhere I would have to get the original mapper (and it didn't say which of the versions I released this applies to), make the patches, log onto Achaea, and try to reproduce the problem.

And it is these "it used to work, I didn't change a thing, and now it doesn't work" problems that are notoriously hard to solve. And experience has shown that after a week of to-ing and fro-ing you often get the response of "well, yes I did re-install Windows, oh and I deleted the entire MUSHclient folder and reinstalled it, and I added a plugin from someone else's site - would that matter?" that you gradually get a clue as to the problem.

BeardedBuddhist said:

I have also noticed you often spend more energy refusing to be helpful ...

I don't think many forum visitors would agree with that. Often people respond along the lines of "wow! - I didn't expect such a detailed response, so quickly".

Sometimes however, when people post a question which is answered in the "getting started" sections, or in the YouTube videos I spent hours making, I think they haven't made the slightest attempt to find the answer for themselves. So sometimes my responses are a bit curt.

BeardedBuddhist said:

Adding to that frustration is knowing a decent scripter with a few minutes could fix what I have spent literally an entire day trying to just figure out.

Well you are guessing there, aren't you? Ask any programmer ... we can all tell how long it takes to boil a 3-minute egg, it is a well-defined problem. But finding bugs? And ones in code modified by other people, or that you didn't write in the first place?

The thing is, in your case, since there is a mapping database, the problem might be there. Looking at the code might tell absolutely nothing. You might need to look at the interrelationship between the database, the code, and the particular part of the MUD you are in. And perhaps the way you have configured your personal player options. Like the GMCP or ATCP options. For all I know, if you typed in some MUD command it would all come good. And bearing in mind that IRE change the way their MUDs work, and the protocols being sent to the client. They don't keep me abreast of those changes.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Twisol USA (2,230 posts)

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 12:08 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Sun 06 Mar 2011 12:12 PM (UTC) by Twisol

Message

Fiendish said:

Would it be wrong of me to vote that last post as spam?

To be fair you weren't exactly a soothing influence. :P

[EDIT]: I can barely make a decent response without being ninja'd by two more replies, which suggests that tempers are hot and fingers hasty. BeardedBuddhist, I stand by my suggestion for you to take a break from this thread for a while.

'Soludra' on Achaea

Blog: http://jonathan.com/
GitHub: http://github.com/Twisol

Posted by

Twisol USA (2,230 posts)

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 12:07 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Sun 06 Mar 2011 12:09 PM (UTC) by Twisol

Message

BeardedBuddhist said:

Twisol said:

Wow, this is classic passive-aggressive behavior. Let me translate:

BeardedBuddhist said:
No wonder you didn't help me, those other poor saps hardly got any help either.

It's pretty obvious at this point that you're a jerkwad, so I'll take my questions elsewhere next time.

FWIW, I'm glad I could help at least somewhat. I'm just disappointed that you had to act this way.

Your age is now obvious, but thank you for translating. What kind of a dick would I have been if I said what you said (but am I lying?). Yeah, I probably should have kept my opinion to myself, even refrained from posting at all, but honestly at first I didn't think I was at all being a jerk. Oh well, this proves I should just keep to myself.

I obviously took some comedic liberties, but it's pretty obvious that you don't have the highest opinion of Nick. (I also didn't say you were a jerk; I suggested you thought Nick was one. What I did say is that you're passive-aggressive.)

I'm trying to be civil, but after a certain point it gets ridiculous. Here are my parting thoughts:

1) Don't treat volunteers like they're obliged to help you. We reserve the right to refuse service.
2) Track down Kairuni and tell him what the problem is. The ideal situation would be to have a collaboration between Nick and Kairuni (since code from both of them is involved). [EDIT]: I guess you already did this.
3) I don't hold grudges, and I'd be glad to help you next time you stop by. Just stop it with the veiled aggression: I'd rather be told I'm a jerkwad to my face than it be subtly insinuated.

Anyways, I should go to bed. In fact, by all rights I should have stopped posting a while ago, but then we all know what happens when someone is wrong on the Internet [1].

[1] http://xkcd.com/386/

'Soludra' on Achaea

Blog: http://jonathan.com/
GitHub: http://github.com/Twisol

Posted by

BeardedBuddhist (21 posts)

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 12:02 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Twisol said:

BeardedBuddhist said:
I apologize to you if I was a tiny bit rude without meaning to be

Please. Really? You were downright insulting at times and you know it. Get some sleep and re-read the thread after you've woken up and you might be able to have a little empathy.

BeardedBuddhist said:
the only thing I can think of is maybe my frustration of not being able to fix something that had no reason to be broken took over.

Nick's mapper isn't what's broken, it's the patch created by someone else. Blizzard doesn't offer support for Warcraft mods, so there's no reason to expect him to solve a problem some third-party introduced. I even looked at the patch and couldn't really understand what it was doing (largely because it depends on understanding the relevant mapper.lua code around it).

I was simply trying to fix the ability to fix the exit lengths, by whatever means. I am sorry, I clearly mispoke if I said that Nick mapper was specifically broken (I remember clearly stating that I thought from the beginning it might be an issue with information from the mud itself).

I tried to achieve this with Dontarion's mapper, and I asked him specifically for help with it. He could not help me. I did get help from Kairuni himself even, but we weren't able to fix it and he had moved on to his own plugin so wasn't too much interesting in figuring out why mc wasn't reading and drawing from a table that it used to. So I came here... but apparently I am an asshole, so, whatever.

Posted by

Fiendish USA (851 posts)

bio Global Moderator

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 11:53 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Would it be wrong of me to vote that last post as spam?

http://aardwolfclientpackage.googlecode.com/

Posted by

BeardedBuddhist (21 posts)

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 11:51 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Sun 06 Mar 2011 11:53 AM (UTC) by BeardedBuddhist

Message

Fiendish said:

Fiendish says, "blah blah blah."

Thank you, vigilante, for teaching me a lesson! I will sleep better now knowing you are out there, patrolling the internet for people to show a thing or two!

Got any more wikipedia links for me?

Pfft, I am done with this, that is, contributing to internet pollution with my garbage. Flame on, troll.

Posted by

Twisol USA (2,230 posts)

Date

Sun 06 Mar 2011 11:51 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

BeardedBuddhist said:
I apologize to you if I was a tiny bit rude without meaning to be

Please. Really? You were downright insulting at times and you know it. Get some sleep and re-read the thread after you've woken up and you might be able to have a little empathy.

BeardedBuddhist said:
the only thing I can think of is maybe my frustration of not being able to fix something that had no reason to be broken took over.

Nick's mapper isn't what's broken, it's the patch created by someone else. Blizzard doesn't offer support for Warcraft mods, so there's no reason to expect him to solve a problem some third-party introduced. I even looked at the patch and couldn't really understand what it was doing (largely because it depends on understanding the relevant mapper.lua code around it).

'Soludra' on Achaea

Blog: http://jonathan.com/
GitHub: http://github.com/Twisol

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