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General Snooping (and some other misc stuff)

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Posted by Boborak   USA  (228 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Sat 19 Apr 2003 12:31 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]

Amended on Thu 17 Apr 2003 11:39 AM (UTC) by Flannel

Message
yeah, definately some fine tuning to be done...

for those of us with Mushclient, its sorta Odd to not be able to edit those things. For example, If I were to make a personalized list of people who, could snoop me all the time, without me authorizing on a case by case..

With the global option however, The case-by-case thing can be setup via scripting easily enough.

There are a few other messages that would be nice to have... I dont remember them all off the top of my head...

If you are given/revoked permission to snoop, or whatever, I dont believe it sends a message to you (it probably doesnt send anything through the chat system either), but that would be nice to have...
Goes along with your ignoring idea. (For that, It might make sense only to send the "XXX is ignoring you" once in a while, if more than once at all per ignore session, and again if not just sent when you toggle the ignore flag on)

I assume that when you set permissions, its all local, and no infomational message is sent via the chat network. It would seem like a lot of wasted space to implement something like that though. Maybe just in the unused message code could be used for a make-shift "information" channel... I dont know. Its not a life and death thing, either, and, can obviously be scripted as just normal messages (emotes would work quite well). Its late, Im rambling. You got the gist of what I was saying 4 sentences ago, most likely, so Im going to stop.

(edited for coherency)
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Posted by Flannel   USA  (1,230 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Reply #1 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 04:18 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]

Amended on Sun 20 Apr 2003 04:22 AM (UTC) by Flannel

Message
Alright, Nick, What all goes on with snooping?
From what I can tell, this is the data flow.

User 1 (Snoop/Commandee)     User 2 (Snoop/Commander)

   Command Window
         |           <----------  Sent Commands
   Command Parsing                     
         |
       [Mud]                           
         |           ----------> Snoop (in all white)
 Triggers/Notes/Etc                    
         |
      Output

So, the snooped data, doesnt include notes/anything done by the client. This has both advantages, and drawbacks.
Advantages are (this is from someone who's helping newbies with the mud), if they gag something, or whatever, you can see that the info is still there.
However, You also cannot see if they gagged something, so they will be telling you they dont see it, and you cant verify that.
Also, when doing commands (world.notes, or whatever) you dont get any callbacks, so cant get error codes.

Snooping also is all white, with little green arrows, is there anyway we can get color codes sent through as well? Made all the ANSI stuff, but doesnt do a lot of good, if we cant get the ANSI codes to begin with, at least, from my understanding of the ANSI things being added. Im just wondering why its all white, when it'd be just as easy in my mind to send ansi stuff through as well (unless there's something blocking it in the imp...)

Maybe Just explinations of why things are done that way.

Also, there anyway we can get some specs on the other protocol? (file transfers, snooping, etc) Or maybe, how the client handles it? (I know what Im asking for... but dont know how to ask for it)
~Flannel

Messiah of Rose
Eternity's Trials.

Clones are people two.
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #2 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:02 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Your original question and my response seem to have disappeared, see the message at the top of the page.
- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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Posted by Flannel   USA  (1,230 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Reply #3 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:08 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Yeah, I was wondering about that, And then That top post ends up on the Smaugh one (probably because of overlapping with numbers and stuff), anyway. I got all those answers, so dont worry about repost.

My first question (on that last post) was related to the last one of the same post, just the order of things happening, etc.
~Flannel

Messiah of Rose
Eternity's Trials.

Clones are people two.
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #4 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:08 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Yes, your diagram is roughly correct.

As I noted somewhere in my documentation, I didn't want to snoop world.notes because the snoop output itself is a world.note, so if you got that back, you would very quickly go into a very large loop if you happened to snoop someone who was snooping you (eg. yourself).

eg. A line arrives from the MUD
It gets sent to you, and displayed as a note
You snoop the note
The snooped note gets displayed as another note
The snooped snooped note gets displayed and so on.

As for colours, I was in a hurry to get some code out for testing, and thought well, white on black, that would make the snooped lines stand out. :)

Also, the green arrow ( > sign) at the start of the line makes it easier to see the difference between snooped lines and actual (other) lines.

Also, again, for MXP MUDs you don't necessarily get pure ANSI colour codes, whereas the chat system uses ANSI codes. Thus, I can't guarantee that every colour can be sent.

However, if you want, I can generate the ANSI codes while outputting snooped code, if you want to see the original colours, and providing you don't mind if they don't appear in the case of MXP-generated colour changes.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #5 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:10 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
What sort of specs do you want? The MudMaster chat specs are on the page:

http://www.gammon.com.au/mushclient/mmchat.htm
- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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Posted by Flannel   USA  (1,230 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Reply #6 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:15 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Yeah, the thought came across about the infinite loop.

And, I figured you were just making it white because it was an easy thing to differentiate between Your output, and theirs.

Do the codes get stripped by the sender? or the reciever? and then, would it be possible to get them? The Green arrow is fine, as obviously, there needs to be some differentiation, and actually, the white isnt BAD, I was just wondering if it would be possible, since Im sure in SOME muds it might make a big difference, Maybe via the callbacks or something... If you do add the color thing, I assume it can be user-defined to be overridden, IN the callbacks (just like your post about.... umm... you posted a code snippet as an example for a callback, might be a good idea to repost it)


Like I said in a previous post (which was subsequently lost into the depths of cyberspace) Im still a little shaky with the Chat stuff, its a lot of new things to be thrown at someone at one time. And Im thinking maybe the protocol would help me understand it a little better.
~Flannel

Messiah of Rose
Eternity's Trials.

Clones are people two.
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Posted by Flannel   USA  (1,230 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Reply #7 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 05:17 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Actually, thats exactly what I was looking for (the MM specs). The page I was looking at before, only was half of that, which is why I was asking for the other half. But yeah, thats exactly it. Thanks nick.
~Flannel

Messiah of Rose
Eternity's Trials.

Clones are people two.
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #8 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 06:52 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
I think your original post asked about snooping someone without them having to answer a dialog box every time.

It seems I allowed for that, but it isn't documented because the option didn't have "chat" in its name.

You need to set the option "auto_allow_snooping", eg.

/world.setoption "auto_allow_snooping", 1

This will allow someone (who you gave permission to snoop) to start snooping without answering any further dialogs.
- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #9 on Sun 20 Apr 2003 07:59 AM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Version 3.39 also now notifies you when various flags are set at the other end. eg. "You can now snoop Nick"
- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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