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Posted by

Flannel USA (1,230 posts)

Date

Reply #15 on Wed 04 Feb 2004 12:21 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Nick, the german thing (the saz) is based on a german keyboard, because of letter frequencies, y and z are switched. Also, youll notice the shift number characters are different (!@#$%^&*()_+) etc. As well as ' ; [ being umlauts. Other keys are mapped differently, its just the way a german keyboard is setup. Windows automatically maps the keys to the language you have installed, it isnt a bug.

So, I would assume Japanese... or whatever else would do something similar, Im sure Cyrillic would be the same as well. (Cyrrilic is non unicode, I believe?)

~Flannel

Messiah of Rose
Eternity's Trials.

Clones are people two.

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Reply #16 on Wed 04 Feb 2004 12:24 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I didn't think it was a bug, it was just that what I typed didn't match the keyboard I had to hand.

What I really want is to know how to input Unicode characters using my existing setup. :)

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Reply #17 on Mon 09 Feb 2004 11:07 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

I am pleased to say that MUSHclient version 3.43 will support, at least partly, Unicode in the form of UTF-8 characters arriving from the MUD. This is an option, as UTF-8 uses the high-order bit of a character which some people will currently be using for simple ASCII accented letters.

Here is a screen dump showing it in action ...

I am having trouble testing it properly as my version of Windows does not allow Unicode to be typed into the command window (in any case, I don't know where I would find, say, Russian letters on my keyboard), however by using the Debug window to push UTF-8 characters onto the screen, it seems to work OK.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Shadowfyr USA (1,774 posts)

Date

Reply #18 on Tue 10 Feb 2004 02:06 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Umm.. I hope that this can be turned off? The mud I play at uses the high bit for its normal purpose and a few things I use myself emply such letters. It may seriously screw up a lot more people than you think if it is on by default and can't be disabled... In fact this is bound to be even worse on mine, since I use a non-TTF font, which doesn't even have the unicode ranges in it. I am not sure how Windows handles that situation, but...

main {
__if (Schrodinger_Cat is Alive or version >= "XP"){
____if version = "Vista" then Performance /= Number_of_Cores;
____call Functional_Code();}
__else
____call Crash_Windows();}

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Reply #19 on Tue 10 Feb 2004 02:46 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Quoting myself:

Quote:

This is an option, as UTF-8 uses the high-order bit of a character which some people will currently be using for simple ASCII accented letters.

Yes, it can be turned off, and it is off by default.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Poromenos Greece (1,037 posts)

Date

Reply #20 on Mon 16 Feb 2004 10:39 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Nice greek text :p

Vidi, Vici, Veni.
http://porocrom.poromenos.org/ Read it!

Posted by

Poromenos Greece (1,037 posts)

Date

Reply #21 on Tue 17 Feb 2004 10:55 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

As for unicode, I haven't tried, because the MUD I play on won't accept it... I can try to send/receive greek but I'm not sure if it will be Unicode or just chars on the upper ASCII range... How can I send and receive Unicode?

Vidi, Vici, Veni.
http://porocrom.poromenos.org/ Read it!

Posted by

Poromenos Greece (1,037 posts)

Date

Reply #22 on Tue 17 Feb 2004 10:15 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Nick, I'm scared :p

Vidi, Vici, Veni.
http://porocrom.poromenos.org/ Read it!

Posted by Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts) bio Forum Administrator

Date Reply #23 on Tue 17 Feb 2004 10:40 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

Quote:

How can I send and receive Unicode?

I was hoping *you* would know that. :)

First, go to Output configuration and check the UTF-8 (Unicode) box.

Then you could go to the debug window (Shift+Ctrl+F12) and enter:



Test: \ce\a4\ce\b7\20\ce\b3\ce\bb\cf\8e\0a

That (with a suitable font) should at least show some Greek letters on the screen (as per the screen dump above).

Now that you have some Unicode text on the screen, you could select it (shift-double-click to select a line), copy and paste down into the command window.

Then try saying or think it, eg.

think blah blah (whatever you copied)

Now, depending on the MUD server, you may or may not see it all echoed back. For example, SMAUG (stock) does not recognise the 8-bit set, and will not necessarily echo back the Unicode text, nor does PennMUSH.

The patch for SMAUG, if you have your own server, is on this site in a recent forum message. I'll investigate PennMUSH.

Now if your keyboard is setup for Greek letters (and don't ask me how to do that) you should in theory be able to type something like:



think <some Greek text>

and have it sent to the MUD, and echoed back, all correctly. Well, that is the theory.

As for testing if it is really Unicode or just high-order ASCII, turn on packet debug for a couple of packets and inspect the text.

Send something short like:



think (one letter)

You should see something like this in the packet debug:


Sent  packet: 9 (10 bytes)

think ....         74 68 69 6e 6b 20 ce a4 0d 0a

The UTF-8 (Unicode) letter is in bold, but you see it takes two bytes. One has the high-order two bits on (Cx), the other doesn't.

The response back from the MUD should look similar (two bytes per Greek character).

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

Poromenos Greece (1,037 posts)

Date

Reply #24 on Wed 18 Feb 2004 11:21 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

OK, I entered the text in the debug window, came out fine, so Unicode works... When I just entered Greek in it, nothing came out (because it was ASCII, not Unicode), and when I switched off UTF-8 the ASCII text got displayed. As for sending Greek to SMAUG and getting it back, the MUD I play just omits the high-order ASCII for greek to what it echoes back, and I don't have a unicode server I could try it on... Hm, let me make a small program that echoes back what i send...

Vidi, Vici, Veni.
http://porocrom.poromenos.org/ Read it!

Posted by

Poromenos Greece (1,037 posts)

Date

Reply #25 on Wed 18 Feb 2004 11:30 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

OK, I made a small greek textfile and had it echoed to MC, at first I saved it as unicode and garbage came out, then I saved it as UTF-8 and it showed up correctly. It is unicode, I turned on the packet debugger and it's 2 bytes per character... Well done :)
Oh, and, of course my keyboard is set up for greek :P Even though it's easy to do that too, just go to the language panel and add Greek to your keyboard layout, so you can test it yourself... I'm using the English edition of WinXP and everything shows up in Greek correctly. The keyboard is a standard 104-key one, have fun typing weird letters :P

Vidi, Vici, Veni.
http://porocrom.poromenos.org/ Read it!

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Reply #26 on Thu 19 Feb 2004 12:20 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

The trick will be to find a MUD that supports UTF-8.

I posted the patch for SMAUG, and am in negotiations with the PennMUSH developers. At this stage, PennMUSH doesn't support UTF-8, because of a test (isprint) in the input routine, and concerns about length-testing of strings.

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

PaulTB (3 posts)

Date

Reply #27 on Mon 13 Sep 2004 01:16 PM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

"I posted the patch for SMAUG"

Could you tell me where that is? I've had quite a thorough Google around and failed to find it.

Posted by

Nick Gammon Australia (18,797 posts)

bio Forum Administrator

Date

Reply #28 on Tue 14 Sep 2004 12:48 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Message

My earlier message on this page referred to "a recent forum post". See this:

http://www.gammon.com.au/forum/bbshowpost.php?bbsubject_id=3757

- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com

Posted by

PaulTB (3 posts)

Date

Reply #29 on Tue 14 Sep 2004 11:04 AM (UTC) [ quote ]

Amended on Thu 16 Sep 2004 11:47 AM (UTC) by PaulTB

Message

Ah, thanks a lot. I'll try it out right away.

I'd like to have a Japanese supporting MUD running - so far I only know of one MOO (MOOsaico) which (sort of) supports Japanese text display / entry.

[EDIT]
Hmm, it compiled but it didn't actually change matters.

I guess I'll have to have a look at isprint
[EDIT2]
[...]
[EDIT3]
Ah, I think it needs
setlocale
to be used if it's going to work properly.
[EDIT4]
And if it's a multi-byte locale then you can't call printf to check a single byte.

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