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character mode ftw

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Posted by Cratylus   (5 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Sat 09 May 2009 08:03 PM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
sup yall

So my codebase has this feature that lets you enable
character mode. This allows you to use a fullscreen
editor to edit files, employ tab completion for
commands (and objects!), use context sensitive arrow
history, etc.

Eventually I foresee using this for other neat stuff.
Not hard to imagine lots of fun things to do with it.

I've read on this site some objections to character
mode. Much like the objections to fullscreen editing
in a mud (you should see the the old MudOS
discussions), I understand that there are concerns
about latency and so on. However, I can assure you
that character mode works just fine an dandy on modern
systems with normal internets, using plain old
xterm/cmd.exe, and I would like to see this functionality
available in MUSHclient as well.

-Crat
http://dead-souls.net
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Posted by Nick Gammon   Australia  (18,770 posts)  [Biography] bio   Forum Administrator
Date Reply #1 on Sat 09 May 2009 10:13 PM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
I can see character mode has some advantages, you have mentioned a few like server-based command completion.

However the concept of doing things by lines is so integrated into MUSHclient's design, it would be pretty much impossible to add it. It was a design decision, not an implementation flaw, that it works the way it does.

There are some nice programs around (I use PuTTY) that handle character mode just fine, including support for colour, UTF-8 and so on.

The extra things MUSHclient gives you, like saving your previous command, or logging lines, won't really work if you don't have lines in the first place. For example, how could it save a previous command if you type something, hit tab, and the server completes the line for you? MUSHclient wouldn't know the completed command.

And how can it log lines, if lines are built up by the cursor jumping all over the screen? Even triggering on server input is harder if there is no predefined "end of line".

Anyway, you don't have to convince me - the source code is available, and anyone that wants to can make the appropriate changes if they feel like it.
- Nick Gammon

www.gammon.com.au, www.mushclient.com
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Posted by Cratylus   (5 posts)  [Biography] bio
Date Reply #2 on Sat 09 May 2009 10:39 PM (UTC)  [ quote  ]
Message
Nick wrote:
"It was a design decision, not an implementation flaw, that it works the way it does."

I didn't mean to imply that I felt your software was flawed.
It was just a thing I think would be cool, that I felt fit
in the suggestions topic.


Nick wrote:
"There are some nice programs around (I use PuTTY) that handle character mode just fine, including support for colour, UTF-8 and so on."

Indeed, but the MUSHclient UI and other features like triggers
and such make MUSHclient-with-charmode a superior choice over
those other options.


Nick wrote:
"The extra things MUSHclient gives you, like saving your previous command, or logging lines, won't really work if you don't have lines in the first place. For example, how could it save a previous command if you type something, hit tab, and the server completes the line for you? MUSHclient wouldn't know the completed command."

Forgive me if I sound argumentative, that is not my intent, but
in my opinion this is not sufficient deterrent. An optional
character mode would not be helpless to record how the server
responds to a tab, for example, and append it as the completed
command. Naturally, recording the history of a cursor crawling
around a fullscreen editor is "out of scope" of anything reasonably
expected of a mud client these days, but the rest of it doesn't
seem awfully challenging if the client is able to recognize
"sent return", "sent tab", and identify received characters.


Nick wrote:
"Anyway, you don't have to convince me - the source code is available, and anyone that wants to can make the appropriate changes if they feel like it."

I understand if you don't feel like it...*that* is certainly
sufficient deterrent :)

-Crat
http://dead-souls.net
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